Asiatam Pz 4- Panzer pain

[jarndice]

Roy Hi,
I swore and swore and wished for the hounds of hell to descend upon the offspring of everyone in the universe having anything to do with the design and sale of the "Asiatam PZ4 Metal Hull",
Then I lifted the body off and lowered it down so that the edge of the rear body panel was touching the inside of the top lip of the rear hull panel, As I lowered it into place the front leading edge of the body seated itself within the hull touching the inside of the lip edge of the front hull panel, it is an exact fit but it (Fortunately )drives you to drink discovering how. Good Luck.

Those transmission covers made me angry (Yet again) because the hull is predrilled for the Gearbox output shaft support bearings, and the transmission covers are supplied to go over the bearings, and yet unless you are prepared to waste too many useful stones in the "Dremel" opening out the cover the covers are useless,
I have been looking on the usual sites for "Plastic" Transmission covers to make the job easier,No success so far.
Shaun.

[Rad_Schuhart]

That is not true. The upper and lower hull fits perfectly. What is bad designed is the attaching system, but the hull fits as it should do.

[jarndice]

Yes Rad that is what I said,
"It is an EXACT FIT".
Shaun.

[43rdRecceReg]

Roy Hi,
I swore and swore and wished for the hounds of hell to descend upon the offspring of everyone in the universe having anything to do with the design and sale of the "Asiatam PZ4 Metal Hull",
Then I lifted the body off and lowered it down so that the edge of the rear body panel was touching the inside of the top lip of the rear hull panel, As I lowered it into place the front leading edge of the body seated itself within the hull touching the inside of the lip edge of the front hull panel, it is an exact fit but it (Fortunately )drives you to drink discovering how. Good Luck.

Those transmission covers made me angry (Yet again) because the hull is predrilled for the Gearbox output shaft support bearings, and the transmission covers are supplied to go over the bearings, and yet unless you are prepared to waste too many useful stones in the "Dremel" opening out the cover the covers are useless,
I have been looking on the usual sites for "Plastic" Transmission covers to make the job easier,No success so far.
Shaun.

Hi Shaun
Well, if it is an 'exact' fit.. I will have a fit... I tried the leading edge configuration, and while that then obscures the embarrassing daylight gap at the back (almost..not exactly), it prompts an even greater need for an anaesthetic (15 yr-old malt whiskey) by bringing the front mudguards into close contact with the drive sprocket. Somehow fitting a track in between the two looks impossible. I'm sure not all hulls are not produced to exacting specs (mine had a kink in it anyway, and several listed parts missing..an indication of a slack approach )..and the evidence for this is simply the maddening process of trying to make them fit together . Thus, one example might be a good fit with HL bits- another, not at all. Furthermore, if the HL deck is symmetrical, then the Asiatam hull is slightly rhomboid: another reason why this early marriage is looking like an early divorce
Och, well, it's too late to turn back now...so I shall just have to make it all work somehow. More cutting, grinding, filling and sanding I suspect. I have still to decide if this will be an 'F2' or a 'G'..and which campaign it was in..and hence which camo scheme it will wear. Right now, though, I think I shall colour it amber: through the bottom of a relaxing glass!!
Incidentally, my kit didn't come with an 'attaching system' (the crossbar and hook system in the illustrations)..so that is something I shall have to devise myself. Probably just as well...

[jarndice]

Roy before the world disappears into a pink/amber relaxing haze,
Before you tried fitting the body to the hull did you screw into place the 2 "C" loops onto each top rear corner ? Because they will stop you from getting the body to fit the hull,
As Rad says for all the good the fixing kit is you are well shot of it,
At a later date I shall lock body to hull using the same method I do with most of my Tanks as well as the doors on my Aircraft, "Neodymion Magnets"
Shaun.

[43rdRecceReg]

Roy before the world disappears into a pink/amber relaxing haze,
Before you tried fitting the body to the hull did you screw into place the 2 "C" loops onto each top rear corner ? Because they will stop you from getting the body to fit the hull,
As Rad says for all the good the fixing kit is you are well shot of it,
At a later date I shall lock body to hull using the same method I do with most of my Tanks as well as the doors on my Aircraft, "Neodymion Magnets"
Shaun.

Thanks for the haze concern, Shaun..but my golden rule for the amber nectar (barring tragic circumstances.. )..is Saturday night only..6 nights entirely tea and coffee based.. Such abstinence is quite remarkable in a half Scottish/ half Irish Highlander ( with genes.. notorious for a booze propensity ).. Well..back to the project.
Yes, I've cleared all the obstructions out of the way (hooks etc..). Here are some pics for comparative purposes. From them I conclude that the Taigen/ HL upper deck is inaccurate at the front; but it does fit the plastic hull properly at the back, whereas the Asiatam metal hull is probably too long by almost a centimetre (5-6 inches on full size tank ). Here we go:

Taigen has incorrect lip/ledge on front panel

I'm too degenerate to be a rivet counter, but this is what the PZ iv leading edge should look like..n.b. no overhang or lip, but a clean edge:

Nice clean leading edge on bow

Panzer IV ausf G front view.jpg (78.44 KiB) Viewed 4740 times

Taigen Pz IV rear is correct where upper deck flange is flush with that on the lower hull, and rear the panel almost overhangs the exhaust..not set back from it:
Compare with Pz IV no 419 I snapped recently at Bovington.. Note position and slenderness of rear flange joining upper and lower decks, as well as upper deck almost overhanging the (battered) exhaust..:

Upper and lower panels are more or less flush

Now, when the HL upper is in the correct position at the leading edge on my Asiatam hull, thus:

Correct alignment at leading edge

The rear looks like this :-

Rear panel should be partially obscuring the exhaust

But, if I line the back up correctly, as per Taigen models and the real thing, this is what happens to the tank's leading edge :

Oh dear..good ventilation though

I think this is a case of Q.E.D. if you and Rad are satisfied with your arrangements, then I can only conclude that the parts you bought are from a different batch, or an alternate Universe ( )..from mine
Roy.
I shall have to lengthen the deck at the back, since shortening the alloy hull is not really an option..

[43rdRecceReg]

Forgot to include this shot. Here the read end is in the correct alignment (compare with Taigen models and real thing); but when it is, we get an unwanted view of the tank interior by the huge gap at the front's leading edge

This is how it should be..

and the real thing:

Surviving Africa Korps Pz IV ausf G

Panzer IV ausf G rear view.jpg (59.07 KiB) Viewed 4733 times

It would be interesting to measure the length of the Taigen/ HL lower hull/ chassis and compare it with the Asiatam also one. I bet there's a difference

[Rad_Schuhart]

Well, here are some very old photos of my Asiatam + Heng long hull. It fits good. All the Upper hulls are exactly the same size.

[jarndice]

Roy Hi,
This is just the beginning of an idea and I might yet walk away calling myself an idiot and I would welcome your thoughts,
The rear panel on the Heng Long BODY is 2mm thick and GLUED in place to the PZ4 body,
If I separated that panel using a debonder and placed the correct width "Plasticard" fillet in between the PZ4 body and PZ4 rear panel that would extend the PZ4 body to the point where it exactly matches the "ASIATAM" metal hull.
This is just a thought and I shall be making a few measurements to get the figures right but it might work and it would not involve cutting the hull or the body so if it doesn't work there is no permanent harm done.
Shaun.

[43rdRecceReg]

Roy Hi,
This is just the beginning of an idea and I might yet walk away calling myself an idiot and I would welcome your thoughts,
The rear panel on the Heng Long BODY is 2mm thick and GLUED in place to the PZ4 body,
If I separated that panel using a debonder and placed the correct width "Plasticard" fillet in between the PZ4 body and PZ4 rear panel that would extend the PZ4 body to the point where it exactly matches the "ASIATAM" metal hull.
This is just a thought and I shall be making a few measurements to get the figures right but it might work and it would not involve cutting the hull or the body so if it doesn't work there is no permanent harm done.
Shaun.

If you're, loco ..then so am I, because I had the same idea. I can assure you, notwithstanding Rad's blurry pix, and front covered in cake icing that the gaps I've highlighted are not an illusion. The assurance that they're 'all the same' doesn't wash with me. The fact remains that my upper deck is almost a centimetre too short for the asiatam hull...no matter which way I pull it, and with all possible obstructions removed (hooks etc..). Having spent quite a bit of time researching the back ends of Pz IVs of all iterations, it's quite clear to me that the rear panel of the upper hull slightly overhangs the exhaust. With the bits I've got, it wouldn't even cover the top of the asiatam back panel. It's like someone whose trousers have shrunk in the wash, trying to pull them down over their ankles...
Anyway, in the photos I took, the upper hull was sitting comfortably on the lower (and perfectly parallel); but it just wouldn't cover the bits it should. If your back panel is inset-- i.e., within/ on the inside the top flange on the asiatam back panel, then it can't possibly look right, I'm afraid.
I'm almost considering buying a cheap plastic HL lower hull from somewhere to make a physical comparison. I suspect that whoever cut the pattern for my asiatam hull was asleep on the job, erred with his measure, or was under the influence of schnapps..
Roy