Disguising the TBU

[grompix]

Disguising the TBU (or DBU or CSI or HBU or IBU or any similar IR detection device that sticks out of the turret!)

I first posted this on "the other place" in February. Due to the unpleasantness of some of the moderators in that forum I thought it would have a more welcome home here. 

I've always wanted to do something with the ugly Tamiya Battle Unit. Some of the guys I hang around with up here in the wild-wastes of the North East come from model-making backgrounds and enjoy the building and painting models to a high standard.  In the past I've tried to get some of them interested in RC-Tanks and IR combat. They certainly like the large size and detail of the 1/16th model AFVs but the looks on their faces when the black "mushrooms" appear just says it all!

For many people the "look" of a model is all-important, especially when nothing is added that detracts from its scale appearance. I've seen some awe-inspiring model-making on this and other forums with precision detailing that literally takes my breath away. A protruding TBU just ruins the visual effect of a beautiful scale replica IMHO. Some people paint them to match the colour of the tank and even add insignia but no matter what you do to them, I just think they do not look right at all.

I am eternally grateful to Nick C (TankHobby) and David (Darkith, who does the excellent DBU module) for their advice on the type of IR receiver that would be compatible with the Tamiya Battle Unit. Armed with that information I managed to locate a source of compatible modules here in the UK from Rapid electronics and was able to work out some ways to "disguise" the ugly TBU's on my tanks.

As to performance of the modified units, I can say that the range does not seem to be affected at all. The modifications do have extra IR receiver modules fitted and as such do not have the "deflection" advantage like Tamiya's inverted pyramid mirror. I can live with that though. I's worth it just to do battle with my tanks without any ugly mushrooms sprouting from their turrets.

Here's my old YouTube clip showing three solutions to the TBU problem.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wERy9RvLqtA" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Like others, I've found the 4 sensor arrangement on my modifications a tad more sensitive than the stock TBU so together with its vulnerability from any angle & range; I reckon it's at a slight disadvantage compared with a standard Tamiya Battle Unit. But this is even less of an issue these days since Darkith's Battle Unit and the Elmod CSI both use multiple sensors too.

Using 4 (or more) replacement IR Receiver modules (sensors) means that they can be positioned anywhere on the model AFV. Putting them in the vision blocks of my Panther worked out fine and I was going to do the same with my Sherman and Pershing. Unlike the Panther though, the vision ports on the latter tanks are a bit low and line of sight is actually obstructed by protrusions on the turret roof in some directions so that's why I used the tank commander to house the sensors instead. I was also curious to see if it was possible to put sensors in a Tank Commander figure. The tiger is unique in that the vision slits are very narrow and the commander is shielded on one side by the opened hatch - hence the gap solution and hidden TBU in the cupola. I've since modified the Tiger by fitting sensors behind each vision slit (the slits are so narrow that I found you do not need to glue in a daylight filter.) I've also managed to put sensors in the turret roof vision ports and inside the turret stowage box on my VVSS Sherman. Anywhere is OK. Just so long as the AFV can take hits from any direction.

Best regards,
Chris

[grompix]

Just in case anyone on this forum wants to have a go, I've put together some step-by-step photos showing how I modified a stock TBU to take 4 sensors in another commander figure. You can use the same principles when positioning the sensors on other parts of the vehicle if you want to.

The only change I've made to the original posting is to recommend not to de-solder the Tamiya IR receiver and drill out the solder holes. The Tamiya PCB is quite fragile and it is easy to damage the etching on the board by re-drilling it. I think a better way is just to cut the 3 legs of Tamiya IR receiver close to the board. The remaining short wire "protrusions" can then be easily soldered to the fly-leads. I've modified the instructions in photo 4 to this effect.

[grompix]

For the light filters I cut up the dark plastic tubular shroud that covers the mirror in a stock TBU (see attached pic) . The plastic is so dark that it is impossible to see through but I assume it must act as a daylight filter on the TBU. Cutting up one shroud will probably do you for 4 or 5 mods. Another substitute material which will apparently do the same job is over-exposed film negative.

I found that it is very important to recess the sensors away from direct sunlight (even with the filter material in place). The first time I put the IR receivers in the Panther vision blocks, the sensor 'bump' was level with the outside of each vision block. It worked great - until it was hit with direct sunlight, and then the range was cut in half! I deepened the back of the blocks with a dremel rotary cutter and recessed the IR Receivers as far back as I could. With the filters in place it works a treat now. It's the same with the TC figure - I recessed the sensors in the body and shoulders and made the holes sort of funnel-shaped so the sensor could be hit from 45 degree side angles but still be hidden from direct sunlight. Don't worry if you make a mess cutting up the dark plastic shroud. The stuff even works when it is sanded! Covering the shoulder holes with clear epoxy helps to disguise the holes – especially if the sides of the holes are the same colour as the painted uniform.

The IR receiver modules I was able to get here in the UK were from Rapid Electronics.

IR RECEIVER MODULE 38KHZ 2.4-5.5V (RC) Order Code 55-092 (Suitable for Tamiya)

http://www.rapidonline.com/productinfo" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. ... leno=71292

TSOP1738 PHOTO MODULE 38KHZ (RC) Order Code 58-0430 (Suitable for Elmod)

http://www.rapidonline.com/productinfo" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. ... leno=77753

I tried some of their other devices and the range from Maplin and RS Electronics but without success.

Here’s a Radio Shack one that Nick C (Tankhobby) found for me.

http://www.radioshack.com/family/index" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. ... 58.2032230

David (Darkith) recommends GP1UE281YK0F he uses for his DBUs. A Google search should find a supplier of these (but not in the UK apparently!)

Nick C says you can use any infrared receiver module that's specified for 38kHz, but 36kHz and 40kHz units will also work as they fall within the bandwidth of the 38kHz units. He also mentioned about being careful with the pin-outs because each manufacturer can be different. Down load and check the datasheets on the part you use. The connections are power, ground and output.

David warned me that that the IR receiver module should be able to work with 3.3 volts for the TBU. 5-volt modules are no good for the Tamiya system. The DBU uses 5-volts though.

Hope this helps people to have a go.

Cheers
Chris 

[grompix]

I'm having problems posting the last two pics...
So I'll try a separate post...




Chris

[971wright]

Hi Chris very nice write up have tried it on my late Tiger and it works very well I am doing my Panzer 3 at the momment and hope to have it finished soon .The only thing you have  missed in the write up is the actual postion of sensors ,for guys thinking of doing this you can fit the sensors anywhere on the tank ,the hull or turret the only thing to remember is they either have to be all in the hull or all in the turret .The reason is do not mix them or you will have 2 sensors facing the same way at some point if you do .The stug III dosnt matter where you place them as long all 4 sides of take a hit ,you could use drivers veiw port for the front sides could be the side veiwing slits (if you dont have schurzen fitted)and the rear could be in a box on the rear deck ,mine will have 3 sensors in a box on rear deck to cover sides and rear and 1 in the drivers port.
  The lights can be placed where you think will be most visable with out spoiling the look of the tank ,in my panzer 3 they will be in the engine air intakes ,on a Tiger you could put them under the engine grills ,I am also working on a switch that will turn on smoke unit when tank is killed to pump smoke out of engine grills will post about this when I have it working .


        regards pete 

[grompix]

For guys thinking of doing this you can fit the sensors anywhere on the tank (hull or turret).

The only thing to remember is they either have to be all in the hull or all in the turret. The reason is do not mix them or you will have 2 sensors facing the same way at some point if you do.
In the stug III it doesn't matter where you place them as long all 4 sides of take a hit. You could use drivers veiw port for the front. The sides could be the side veiwing slits (if you dont have schurzen fitted) and the rear could be in a box on the rear deck. Mine will have 3 sensors in a box on rear deck to cover sides and rear and 1 in the drivers port.

The lights can be placed where you think will be most visable without spoiling the look of the tank. In my panzer 3 they will be in the engine air intakes. On a Tiger you could put them under the engine grills. I am also working on a switch that will turn on smoke unit when tank is killed to pump smoke out of engine grills. I will post about this when I have it working.

Spot on Pete. Thanks for elucidating.
I'm especially keen to see how your smoking KO'd tank idea works out. I think that would be a really brill mod to do.

Cheers
Chris

[oztruck]

Thanks for a great article.

I have liked the idea of doing battle with other tanks using IR but here in Australia other tankers are few and far between.

I would like to convert several of my tanks to work together but I have never liked the idea of the thing sticking out of the top of the tank.

My question is,
Is there any way to make my tanks as strong or as weak as a real one. EG: Hard to kill head on, 3/4 hits. easy from the rear 1 hit, a bit harder from the side, 2 hits and anything that is over 30 deg has no effect.
I would also like to be able to fight "hull down" but still be able to take hits.

I have fitted a couple of my tanks with mini spy Vid cameras and have had a lot of fun driving them and fighting them using BB's and viewing the action as a driver or gunner on the TV, but sometimes it is hard to see if you scored a hit or not. also some people lie about being hit or not.

Any help or ideas will be greatly appreciated

[Matdragon]

For guys thinking of doing this you can fit the sensors anywhere on the tank (hull or turret).

The only thing to remember is they either have to be all in the hull or all in the turret. The reason is do not mix them or you will have 2 sensors facing the same way at some point if you do.
In the stug III it doesn't matter where you place them as long all 4 sides of take a hit. You could use drivers veiw port for the front. The sides could be the side veiwing slits (if you dont have schurzen fitted) and the rear could be in a box on the rear deck. Mine will have 3 sensors in a box on rear deck to cover sides and rear and 1 in the drivers port.

The lights can be placed where you think will be most visable without spoiling the look of the tank. In my panzer 3 they will be in the engine air intakes. On a Tiger you could put them under the engine grills. I am also working on a switch that will turn on smoke unit when tank is killed to pump smoke out of engine grills. I will post about this when I have it working.

Spot on Pete. Thanks for elucidating.
I'm especially keen to see how your smoking KO'd tank idea works out. I think that would be a really brill mod to do.

Cheers
Chris

i think the blitz has done this allready, he has a vid on youtube of it and posted it on the forum not to be named,

anyway this is a brilliant mod chis, and i have to say in battle it works perfectly. no flaws atall, infact it is more reliable than the originall, as it cant accidentaly fall out

cheers mate,

matt

[grompix]

You're right Matt. I thought I'd seen something like that before!

Oztruck - ACE tried to put sensors around the hull of a tank and changed the apertures so that they would only register hits at certain ranges (simulating effectiveness of armour I suppose). Here's the link :-

http://www.tankace.org/rts_rev_1_print2.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One problem with trying to simulate real tanks too closely is the tendency to lose some or all of Tamiya's simple elegant weight-of-tank/ num-of-hits system. All rc tanks using the Tamiya (or Tamiya compatible) combat system are fairly matched (in theory at least). So any model can take on any other model with an equal chance of getting a kill - regardless of whether it is classed as light, medium or heavy.
I know it might seem great to have a system that simulates real tank combat more closely but you will lose the fairness of combat that Tamiya has built in. People would only want to build and operate models of the biggest and most powerful tanks. Nobody would bother much with light and medium AFVs.

As to your hull-down request, I know some people (in the USA I think) have mounted IR receiver sensors in the tank hull. (See pics below from greg022754 on RCU). This would certainly simulate a hull down position but would also make a turreted tank invulnerable from the front when positioned behind a hull-height obstacle. I don't know how other players would feel about that. Probably more acceptable with a vehicle like the Stug III.
Similarly, I've also read accounts of people putting tape over the front of a TBU/DBU/CSI to simulate the frontal invulnerability of certain tanks like the Jagdtiger. Again, I would think it would depend on yourself and the people you are playing with.
At the end of the day, this hobby is all about having fun, so if you think its a good idea then go for it

Cheers
Chris






         

[oztruck]

Thanks for the help, I can understand what you are saying. Is there any way apart from shielding or covering the receivers to compensate for armor thickness. EG: Hard to get a kill head on, easy from rear, a bit harder from side?