Bare metal tank

[DzNile4L]

Hey guys, my next build, (tiger 2 with 105mm cannon) will hopefully sport a sort of unpainted paintjob .

I’m hoping you guys have some cool ideas about this project, (red oxide primer has been too over done ) so i have some points i’d like some discussion on

1, i’ve heard that the actual weld that held the armour together would not rust, but i have my doubts, as everything i have welded has the ability to rust, except that one time brazing aluminium (but i don’t want to talk about that).

2, I understand that the tanks were put together from outsourced components, would these come unpainted , primed, or finished in a dunkelgelb colour?

3, those hulls sitting outside the factories, while they are generally accepted as primed in red oxide covered in chalk markings, could i be right in assuming that a time saving initiative would have them sent (again assuming they came from skoda or something) that they would be still in bare metal.

4, then again those cannon barrels, are they really primed with a heatproof grey?

5, also reusing components off of wreaked or busted tanks, was this a common practice?


Cheers, DzNile4L

[HERMAN BIX]

1, i’ve heard that the actual weld that held the armour together would not rust, but i have my doubts, as everything i have welded has the ability to rust, except that one time brazing aluminium (but i don’t want to talk about that).

The compounds in the weld deposit material required to successfully join the parent metal in the armour steel would not rust. It may oxidise a bit but not rust. Arc and Mig welding products such as Philips RSP's and similar have what is essentially a stainless steel composition, giving suitability to joining high tensile- high alloy steel. Ive seen relic tanks that have been out of doors since they were destroyed and while the higher iron content in the armour rusts a bit(not a lot) the welds are generally very crisp.

2, I understand that the tanks were put together from outsourced components, would these come unpainted , primed, or finished in a dunkelgelb colour?

Depending on the model, the sub-components would be at least primed, if possible base colour painted according to the directive in place at that time by the Waffenamt. If there were parts produced & waiting to freight, and an order to change base colour or some other directive, those would go as they were then new ones would be changed accordingly. Although, the Germans did run a last in -first out methodology which did mean at times older or superceeded parts would wait and the new ones would go at the next opportunity. Tank building during the war was still a business venture. Quality control, warranty, parts back up, design acceptance trials, design acceptance inspections, final design acceptance, unit acceptance at the door of the factory,and of course payment, so anything that was involved with the finished product had to be accountable to someone.

3, those hulls sitting outside the factories, while they are generally accepted as primed in red oxide covered in chalk markings, could i be right in assuming that a time saving initiative would have them sent (again assuming they came from skoda or something) that they would be still in bare metal.

Its not impossible, but, very unlikely that raw steel would have ever been freighted over distance due to the potential for uncontrollable delays. No good having a hull arrive weeks later into the assembly contractor that is so rusted it cant be fitted out without redressing. Again, it depends on what the manufacturing directive was for that specific machine at the time. If the Waffenamt asked for it to be primed, and it wasn't, someone would need to justify that or the company would not get paid............or worse, those in charge could be called to explain their poor standards to men in suits with no sense of humor

4, then again those cannon barrels, are they really primed with a heatproof grey?

Apparently- yes. Barrels are a high precision sub-asset that requires a lot of skill,machine time and materials. The rifling alone would have been protected by a coating of anti corrosion compound(similar to Cosmoline) and plugged to avoid any contamination or oxidisation while in transit. The exterior would be protected to the same care level, heat resistant paint and wooden travel crates.

5, also reusing components off of wreaked or busted tanks, was this a common practice?

Later on and when there was access to knocked out vehicles-yes. fast forward to '43 onwards, As the Germans were constantly forced back off the field when losses were incurred, I would say that practice dropped off significantly.
The famous Gruppe Fehrmann Tigers are a classic example of rear area/ordanance reapir dept using new or reclaimed parts to rebirth older tanks. But the forward maintenance teams would have been constantly falling back & unable to recover tanks or parts that they otherwise could have used to get a knocked out machine easily back in the fight. The records of German tank crews having to destroy their mounts due to minor breakdowns or damage that could not be recovered due to enemy action or lack of recovery equipment is huge .

[DzNile4L]

Thanks Bix!

[jhamm]

5, also reusing components off of wreaked or busted tanks, was this a common practice?

Later on and when there was access to knocked out vehicles-yes. fast forward to '43 onwards, As the Germans were constantly forced back off the field when losses were incurred, I would say that practice dropped off significantly.
The famous Gruppe Fehrmann Tigers are a classic example of rear area/ordanance reapir dept using new or reclaimed parts to rebirth older tanks. But the forward maintenance teams would have been constantly falling back & unable to recover tanks or parts that they otherwise could have used to get a knocked out machine easily back in the fight. The records of German tank crews having to destroy their mounts due to minor breakdowns or damage that could not be recovered due to enemy action or lack of recovery equipment is huge .

A lttle addition..
A tank could not/should not be abandoned lightly, the commander had to be able to cogently justify this.
Everything possible was always done to salvage damaged vehicles and bring them in for repair.

Here some Pictures:

[DzNile4L]

Thanks Jhamm!