Torque vs RPM

If you have a tank query and you can't find the answer anywhere else, post here. (TIP - Check for answers in FAQ, use the 'search' facility or even check this board before posting here).
Forum rules
If your question is electronics related please post it in one of the relevant boards here: viewforum.php?f=31
ALPHA
Major-General
Posts: 10960
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:06 am

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by ALPHA »

tomhugill wrote:
ALPHA wrote:
tomhugill wrote:
I'm confused. What do you mean by speed controller? Every electric motor is controlled by a speed controller. A speed controller can't give your motor more torque. A better quality one can give better throttle response.
Image
Speed Controller :haha: :haha: ....several different types for different apps ...I've seen some that look like volume controls...so you can actually dial in the resistance...any change in resistance cuts or increases current flow..so does affect the power output of any motor Ht or Hs :D
I also don't understand how you can argue the motors not a factor when specific crawler motors have 1/3 rpm of a standard 540.

The lower KV (ie torquier) motors I've had always seem to have stronger magnets and therefore are harder to spin by hand.
I'm not arguing anything about the motors...just defining HIGH torque vs High speed ...and how there is a myth about performance that exists ;)

ALPHA
First off you can't increase flow of current, only decrease it. This will make a motor run slower at given throttle but won't increase torque (try it in your tank by wiring a resistor in series with the motor). Going back to v=ir for constant voltage increasing resistance decreases current.
What happens if you use a stronger battery...isn't that increasing the voltage? but good observation tom...thing is it really depends on the speed controller
if zero is a middle point...then the adjustment can go either up or down...now wouldn't that be increasing and decreasing even if the max output is say 7.4?
When you decrease the voltage...to a minimum point.... and bring it back up...isn't that also considered increasing the level of flow ?
Think of a radio to put it simply... it runs on a constant power output...controlled by a rheostat or volume control.... are you not increasing the flow by turning the volume up?
Anyway back in the days of mechanical speed controllers that's how you varied speed, increase resistance and as I'm sure you know run at low throttle those things got aweful hot, I know people who had boats set fire using them.

The way an esc works now is by sending a series of pulses to the motor by varying frequency changes speed. Voltage remains the same.

Typically a motor will draw much more current when stalled than when running. This is because when running, it is also acting as a generator, creating an EMF which opposes the applied EMF and reduces the overall current. As more mechanical load is applied, the motor slows, the back emf decreases, and more current is drawn. If sufficient mechanical load is applied, the motor stalls/stops rotating, and therefore there is no back EMF at all, and the current is limited by the supply or by the resistance of the windings.
It's the same basic theory...just with more hands free operation...Electronic Modulation in pulses.. still modifies the power output ...so what are you trying to say...that hasn't been addressed already ? :haha: :haha:

ALPHA
User avatar
Tankbear
Lieutenant
Posts: 3001
Joined: Sun May 22, 2011 12:00 pm
Contact:

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by Tankbear »

Alpha,

You've misunderstood what Tom was saying about only decreasing power.

Battery connected to motor = maximum power to motor

add speed controller between battery and motor = maximum power to motor stays same but can only be decreased by the speed controller.

Therefore a speed controller only decreases power to the motor relative to the battery supply.

So yes a speed controller or radio volume to us can increase and decrease power but in technical terms it only decreases the power from maximum.

Michael

Did you run in your speed 400 motors? this makes a big difference to the power of them.

And as a test try powering the motor directly from the battery to see if makes any difference. If improves then the problem lies with your wiring or electronics.

I did this video a bit back to demonstrate the strong drive control of the IBU2 but it has JP400 motors installed which you can see are very strong, you should find most aftermarket motors will be equally as good.



Ian.
www.mad-tanks.weebly.com
www.rctankelectronics.com
www.rc-truck.weebly.com
www.rc-boat.weebly.com
ALPHA
Major-General
Posts: 10960
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:06 am

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by ALPHA »

Tankbear wrote:Alpha,

You've misunderstood what Tom was saying about only decreasing power.

Battery connected to motor = maximum power to motor

add speed controller between battery and motor = maximum power to motor stays same but can only be decreased by the speed controller.

Therefore a speed controller only decreases power to the motor relative to the battery supply.

So yes a speed controller or radio volume to us can increase and decrease power but in technical terms it only decreases the power from maximum.
No problem from me Tankbear...I understand the theory fine... Wax on Wax off lol

by the way...did you see the question posted about that hobbywhatever M1 Abrams...was hoping you could help that guy out :D

ALPHA
User avatar
Tankbear
Lieutenant
Posts: 3001
Joined: Sun May 22, 2011 12:00 pm
Contact:

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by Tankbear »

ALPHA wrote:
by the way...did you see the question posted about that hobbywhatever M1 Abrams...was hoping you could help that guy out :D

ALPHA
Nope I missed that what section?
www.mad-tanks.weebly.com
www.rctankelectronics.com
www.rc-truck.weebly.com
www.rc-boat.weebly.com
ALPHA
Major-General
Posts: 10960
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:06 am

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by ALPHA »

Tankbear wrote:
ALPHA wrote:
by the way...did you see the question posted about that hobbywhatever M1 Abrams...was hoping you could help that guy out :D

ALPHA
Nope I missed that what section?
I humbly defer to you Tankbear
http://www.rctankwarfare.co.uk/forums/v ... 81&t=14007

ALPHA
ALPHA
Major-General
Posts: 10960
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:06 am

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by ALPHA »

NEVER MIND LOL


ALPHA
User avatar
MichaelC
2nd Lieutenant
Posts: 2449
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:03 pm
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by MichaelC »

@tom, Clark electronics

@ ALPHA, its a resin kit so everything is custom. I am not good at DIY stuff, and I have to raised the gears to clear the narrow lower so there is no room to muck around at all. I would rather try installing different motors and see the result.

@Tankbear, the 400s I have are from Maxxpro and they seem to be doing the job. I have some after market ones that looks like they are the same as 480s and might give that a try but I am worry about start about the rest of the tank (resin hull, plastic tracks and resin boggies).

MichaelC.
ALPHA
Major-General
Posts: 10960
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:06 am

Re: Torque vs RPM

Post by ALPHA »

MichaelC wrote:@tom, Clark electronics

@ ALPHA, its a resin kit so everything is custom. I am not good at DIY stuff, and I have to raised the gears to clear the narrow lower so there is no room to muck around at all. I would rather try installing different motors and see the result.

@Tankbear, the 400s I have are from Maxxpro and they seem to be doing the job. I have some after market ones that looks like they are the same as 480s and might give that a try but I am worry about start about the rest of the tank (resin hull, plastic tracks and resin boggies).

MichaelC.
Yup ...Understood Michael...Personally I applaud you for getting this far...especially after seeing how tight things are in that hull...resin kits can be fun to modify...but yes again...it can be really tricky especially if you want everything to line up and function...

Stick to your guns.... find what works...Good Luck :thumbup:

ALPHA
Post Reply

Return to “General Questions”