Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
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This section is for posting a build log of your Heng Long tank.
Questions relating to issues you are having with your tank(s) should be posted in the General Questions forum here: viewforum.php?f=14
This section is for posting a build log of your Heng Long tank.
Questions relating to issues you are having with your tank(s) should be posted in the General Questions forum here: viewforum.php?f=14
- Estnische
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Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
As Tiger6 said on an earlier page, it helps to know where you are starting, so I did a bit of research into the ‘Boomerang’ Sherman that is guiding my build and went looking for some wartime pictures. What I found was some sobering history.
The tank belonging to the Flying Heritage and Combat Armor Museum is painted up as ‘Boomerang’ 3033274, which it is not. The Museum’s M4A1 was built at Pressed Steel Car Company in Chicago. It was accepted into the U.S. Army in 1943 and most likely stayed in the United States to train new tank crews headed overseas. Early in 1945, the tank was sent to a remanufacturing facility and then released to the Dutch army as part of the Major Defense Acquisition Program.
When the tank was no longer useful, it was acquired by a collector and restorer. From 2011 to 2012 the vintage Sherman was restored to its WWII form at C&C Military Services in the UK. Part of the restoration included removal of bogey and sprocket spacers to allow use of wider tracks. These images are screenshots from the Museum's presentation clip released last week.
Today it wears the colours of ‘Boomerang’ from B Company, 31st Tank Battalion in the 7th Armored Division. There are no known photos of Boomerang, but here is a sister tank from B Company, ‘Battling Bitch’.
The 31st Tank Battalion consisted of 3 companies (A, B and C) and was part of the 7th Armored Division, that trained in California and arrived in England in June 1944, and landed on Omaha and Utah beaches in mid-August. They initially bivouacked near Lessay, before heading south to Laval, then east to Chartres two days later. Initial contact was made with a small force of infantry and anti-tank guns on the outlying villages. A two-pronged night attack was taken on the town, which then involved three days of fighting against 3000 German troops in urban terrain that made life difficult for the tankers.
After the battle they moved north to Dreux where they encountered stiff enemy resistance and moved about in response, before heading off to Melun to take on the enemy five days later. After mopping up they were sent out northwest towards Reims being held up by anti-tank positions, mines and blown bridges. Eventually crossing by pontoon bridges, they went on to liberated Chateau-Thierry and then Verdun on 31 August.
The 7th Armored halted briefly for refuelling and then on 6 September drove on toward the Moselle and made a crossing near Dornot. This crossing had to be withdrawn in the face of the heavy fortifications around Metz. On 25 September 1944, the 7th Armored Division began the march to the Netherlands where they were needed to protect the east flank of the corridor opened by Operation Market Garden.
On 30 September, the 7th Armored Division launched an attack from the north on the town of Overloon. On the defending side was the German Kampfgruppe Walther consisting of paratroopers from the 21. Regiment, a battalion sized unit from the 10. SS-Panzerdivision Frundsberg equipped with Panthers and STuG IVs, and a Luftwaffe 88 mm battalion. The hard core of the unit was the 107. Panzerbrigade. The Germans had sufficient time to be reinforced and to prepare defences, so the 7th took heavy losses and had to withdraw. The British 3rd Infantry and 11th Armoured Divisions took up the attack preceded by artillery and bomber attacks that pounded the villages around Overloon, and more fierce fighting ensued until the enemy was subdued. The allied units lost many tanks from 30 September to 8 October and so like much of Europe, wrecks were left behind on private lands. In 1947 local reports indicated there were the 26 tanks still left behind in the Overloon locale.
Comparison of reports from evacuated residents and the local Burgomaster compared with battlefield reports and serial numbers gives some indication of the whereabouts of the losses by the 31st. At Vortum north of Overloon, four tanks including three from B company were identified including 3033274 Boomerang. The divisional records indicate "Left St Antonis 1300 Arr at Boxmeer 1330 Distance traveled 2 Mi. 1st and 2d Platoon attacked Vortum 0630 lost 4 Tks and 1 Half Track" on 1st October.
Unfortunately, in the heat of battle, not all the dead could be recovered. Returning locals buried those they could find. In March 1947 the Burgomaster indicated that human remains could still be seen inside four of the tanks including Boomerang. Along with others that were buried, these were later recovered and buried at a cemetery for US servicemen at Margraten. As the other crew survived the destruction of Boomerang, the remains were attributed to Private Thurman Meeks who had been declared MIA.
When it came time to choose markings for the Flying Heritage and Combat Armor Museum’s new acquisition, late Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen chose to do a tribute to Boomerang.
The tank belonging to the Flying Heritage and Combat Armor Museum is painted up as ‘Boomerang’ 3033274, which it is not. The Museum’s M4A1 was built at Pressed Steel Car Company in Chicago. It was accepted into the U.S. Army in 1943 and most likely stayed in the United States to train new tank crews headed overseas. Early in 1945, the tank was sent to a remanufacturing facility and then released to the Dutch army as part of the Major Defense Acquisition Program.
When the tank was no longer useful, it was acquired by a collector and restorer. From 2011 to 2012 the vintage Sherman was restored to its WWII form at C&C Military Services in the UK. Part of the restoration included removal of bogey and sprocket spacers to allow use of wider tracks. These images are screenshots from the Museum's presentation clip released last week.
Today it wears the colours of ‘Boomerang’ from B Company, 31st Tank Battalion in the 7th Armored Division. There are no known photos of Boomerang, but here is a sister tank from B Company, ‘Battling Bitch’.
The 31st Tank Battalion consisted of 3 companies (A, B and C) and was part of the 7th Armored Division, that trained in California and arrived in England in June 1944, and landed on Omaha and Utah beaches in mid-August. They initially bivouacked near Lessay, before heading south to Laval, then east to Chartres two days later. Initial contact was made with a small force of infantry and anti-tank guns on the outlying villages. A two-pronged night attack was taken on the town, which then involved three days of fighting against 3000 German troops in urban terrain that made life difficult for the tankers.
After the battle they moved north to Dreux where they encountered stiff enemy resistance and moved about in response, before heading off to Melun to take on the enemy five days later. After mopping up they were sent out northwest towards Reims being held up by anti-tank positions, mines and blown bridges. Eventually crossing by pontoon bridges, they went on to liberated Chateau-Thierry and then Verdun on 31 August.
The 7th Armored halted briefly for refuelling and then on 6 September drove on toward the Moselle and made a crossing near Dornot. This crossing had to be withdrawn in the face of the heavy fortifications around Metz. On 25 September 1944, the 7th Armored Division began the march to the Netherlands where they were needed to protect the east flank of the corridor opened by Operation Market Garden.
On 30 September, the 7th Armored Division launched an attack from the north on the town of Overloon. On the defending side was the German Kampfgruppe Walther consisting of paratroopers from the 21. Regiment, a battalion sized unit from the 10. SS-Panzerdivision Frundsberg equipped with Panthers and STuG IVs, and a Luftwaffe 88 mm battalion. The hard core of the unit was the 107. Panzerbrigade. The Germans had sufficient time to be reinforced and to prepare defences, so the 7th took heavy losses and had to withdraw. The British 3rd Infantry and 11th Armoured Divisions took up the attack preceded by artillery and bomber attacks that pounded the villages around Overloon, and more fierce fighting ensued until the enemy was subdued. The allied units lost many tanks from 30 September to 8 October and so like much of Europe, wrecks were left behind on private lands. In 1947 local reports indicated there were the 26 tanks still left behind in the Overloon locale.
Comparison of reports from evacuated residents and the local Burgomaster compared with battlefield reports and serial numbers gives some indication of the whereabouts of the losses by the 31st. At Vortum north of Overloon, four tanks including three from B company were identified including 3033274 Boomerang. The divisional records indicate "Left St Antonis 1300 Arr at Boxmeer 1330 Distance traveled 2 Mi. 1st and 2d Platoon attacked Vortum 0630 lost 4 Tks and 1 Half Track" on 1st October.
Unfortunately, in the heat of battle, not all the dead could be recovered. Returning locals buried those they could find. In March 1947 the Burgomaster indicated that human remains could still be seen inside four of the tanks including Boomerang. Along with others that were buried, these were later recovered and buried at a cemetery for US servicemen at Margraten. As the other crew survived the destruction of Boomerang, the remains were attributed to Private Thurman Meeks who had been declared MIA.
When it came time to choose markings for the Flying Heritage and Combat Armor Museum’s new acquisition, late Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen chose to do a tribute to Boomerang.
Last edited by Estnische on Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Estnische
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Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
... which brings me to a dilemma.
According to the Sherman Minutia site serial numbers, 3033274 was an M4 made by American Loco. By comparison, 3036792 'Battling Bitch' is an M4A1 made by Pressed Steel Car.
According to the Sherman Minutia site serial numbers, 3033274 was an M4 made by American Loco. By comparison, 3036792 'Battling Bitch' is an M4A1 made by Pressed Steel Car.
- Son of a gun-ner
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Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
Oh dear. Well, unless you're a rivet counting enthusiast, and need this model to be an exact copy of one or the other, who won't forgive themselves if they find, horror of horrors a minor discrepancy once the model is finished. You could always do what Frankie does and make up your own name and have the model close to accurate with your own twist.
How about "Kraut Crusher"
How about "Kraut Crusher"
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Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
Or at least pick a name beginning with B so that it fits in with common US practice of having the name begin with the company letter - close enough for government work is my motto in the absence of any photo's
Honestly I don't think anyone here is going to mind a little artistic licence, its the 'utter nonsense presented as gospel truth' stuff that causes eyebrows to be raised - not because we necessarily care about the model and its owner, more because if it goes unchallenged than the next poor soul who comes along trying to research something is going to find duff information
(secret option B - just make a model of the museum piece! )
Honestly I don't think anyone here is going to mind a little artistic licence, its the 'utter nonsense presented as gospel truth' stuff that causes eyebrows to be raised - not because we necessarily care about the model and its owner, more because if it goes unchallenged than the next poor soul who comes along trying to research something is going to find duff information
(secret option B - just make a model of the museum piece! )
Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
Actually, if you are interested in a tank at the battle of Overloon, do a bit of googling around the museum there (assuming you haven't already), as several of their Shermans (plus other tanks) were wrecked 'on site' during the various battles.
(I have some pictures taken during a trip in 2016 around here some place as well...)
(I have some pictures taken during a trip in 2016 around here some place as well...)
- Estnische
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Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
Thanks guys. You have raised some good points. It won't be a fully accurate build - there are things my Sherman will have that are not 100% accurate as a scale model. So onward and upward.
I’ve not been entirely happy with the look of the Mato upper hull when you compare it to M4A1s such as the museum's ‘Boomerang’.
The M4A1 hull is nicely rounded, especially when you look at the front corners of the Mato at the guards where it is extremely flat, and the transition to the sides is sharp.
There is no ‘meat’ to work with, so I added some 2mm plasticard sheet, and filled in the gaps with various sizes of plasticard rod.
Lots of filing and filling later, it looks better. It’s not quite up to Nick Aguilar’s resin hull. But at least my girl has more curves.
I’ve not been entirely happy with the look of the Mato upper hull when you compare it to M4A1s such as the museum's ‘Boomerang’.
The M4A1 hull is nicely rounded, especially when you look at the front corners of the Mato at the guards where it is extremely flat, and the transition to the sides is sharp.
There is no ‘meat’ to work with, so I added some 2mm plasticard sheet, and filled in the gaps with various sizes of plasticard rod.
Lots of filing and filling later, it looks better. It’s not quite up to Nick Aguilar’s resin hull. But at least my girl has more curves.
- Son of a gun-ner
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Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
Mr Estnische, you top fella
I once made a comment about the Mato hull not being curvaceous enough, and the response was that there was nothing wrong with it
And you're correct about Nick's hull, it is very nice just a shame he doesn't do a small hatch version, otherwise I would have had at least three off of him.
I once made a comment about the Mato hull not being curvaceous enough, and the response was that there was nothing wrong with it
And you're correct about Nick's hull, it is very nice just a shame he doesn't do a small hatch version, otherwise I would have had at least three off of him.
Mick - The grit in the underpants of life!
And always happy to spare the bytes
TOTM needs YOU support YOUR TOTM competition, I'm doing my part, are YOU?
And always happy to spare the bytes
TOTM needs YOU support YOUR TOTM competition, I'm doing my part, are YOU?
Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
In fairness to Mato, the large hatch front hull can have quite a pronounced flat on either 'cheek' - definitely more noticeable on the Composite hulls, a case of different foundry's interpretations of the design
As for the radius along the sides where it meets the top, well, erm yeah...
Its almost like they had designed it with a later reuse of the tool (or CAD model) for a composite Firefly 1C - which, given what we were originally told when it was developed, was a possibility?
As for the radius along the sides where it meets the top, well, erm yeah...
Its almost like they had designed it with a later reuse of the tool (or CAD model) for a composite Firefly 1C - which, given what we were originally told when it was developed, was a possibility?
- Son of a gun-ner
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Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
I agree about the flat cheeks on later models, but not with the Mato sharp corner to the sides. And as you can see, even a composite has that corner more rounded.
Mick - The grit in the underpants of life!
And always happy to spare the bytes
TOTM needs YOU support YOUR TOTM competition, I'm doing my part, are YOU?
And always happy to spare the bytes
TOTM needs YOU support YOUR TOTM competition, I'm doing my part, are YOU?
Re: Heng Long Sherman M4A1 (75)
Hey, I was trying to be charitable here...
If I were to be brutally honest - it looks like they spent all of the CAD budget on doing the glacis and hatches, and on discovering that they had ran out of time, quickly slapped on simple constant radius fillets around the cheeks and down the sides and called it 'done' - looks like a proper "Friday afternoon" job there
If I were to be brutally honest - it looks like they spent all of the CAD budget on doing the glacis and hatches, and on discovering that they had ran out of time, quickly slapped on simple constant radius fillets around the cheeks and down the sides and called it 'done' - looks like a proper "Friday afternoon" job there