Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

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ALPHA
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by ALPHA »

SovereignZuul wrote:I don't dare tell anyone I know what my Armortek stuff cost. They'll lock me up! :haha:


P.S. Alpha! the more weight the better! I can't wait to see how heavy mine is once it's assembled! @)
UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH... I've already had the displeasure of running over my feet with my Sherman and KV2 :lolno: ...so exceeding 12lbs...can't be better in my mind :haha: .. Weight does add to the traction ...but finding balance to me is more important ;)

1/6th is a different story though 8O

ALPHA

PS...Running over feet is a good test...if it hurts...it's heavy enough :haha: :haha: :haha:
ALPHA
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - General Modifications (Experts Only)

Post by ALPHA »

jarndice wrote:One of the biggest problems that arises on conversing on the www is the inability to view the "speaker", it is amazing how much information one gains from merely seeing the features of a speaker, add to that the lack of inflection and the nuances of flowing speech are lost and often what was spoken is received with the exact opposite meaning. an awful lot of people are perceived as arrogant when they are gentle souls wanting only to impart their knowledge, Enthusiasm added to knowledge often produce's poor English grammar and this particular Forum has ( I AM GLAD TO SAY) many members whose first language is not ENGLISH/ENGLISH, those of us who are fortunate enough to be English (SEE WHAT I MEAN ABOUT SOUNDING ARROGANT)should think of those times when on Holiday/Vacation struggling to get one's self understood, when I come across messages such as the one from Bulldog82 I look at what information is being imparted and if I perceive it to be relevant I disregard the diction. :yawn: :yawn: :yawn: shaun
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM :think: ...............No inclusion to the subject of TYPOS :haha: :haha:

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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by Saxondog »

Unfortunate. The whole business. The guy seemed bright.
Urban dictionary-SAXONDOG-derogatory term for anglosaxon people
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CanadianBulldog22
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by CanadianBulldog22 »

Hey guys,

I decided to continue with my thread. I want to address some of the comments that were left before I talk about the next topic.

1. Merlin707, RE: Expert in title

I have changed the title, it was never meant to be insulting. Why I wrote 'expert' was basically because I can remember being very young and trying to take on projects that were beyond my knowledge or skill level at the time. In most cases I ended up ruining whatever I was trying to modify. I mean it more as a disclaimer to beginners than anything. Also to drill a perfectly centered hole in hard plastic that is exactly 4mm deep and insert a bearing IS beyond some peoples ability, and likely most peoples tool set (who has a 11mm drill bits laying around?) but it is not above anyone's ability to buy metal upgrades. If the whole is off center or not perpendicular to the surface, the wheel is screwed.

2. ALPHA & Wibblywoobly, RE: Topic #1

I like your thought process, I didn't even think about dirt in the tracks slowing it down. In my opinion I think the friction in the wheels is much more detrimental that one would expect. The coefficient of dynamic friction (friction constant while moving) of plastic on plastic is 0.20 in the best case. The coefficient of dynamic friction for a quality roller bearing is around 0.0018. That will create a frictional force over 100x larger without these very light bearings. It also helps smooth out the motion at slower speeds.

WibblyWobbly was concerned about mud getting into the bearings, if done correctly the bearing should be completely recessed into the plastic and you will be able to re-install the hub covers. This should keep anything from getting into the bearing from the front side (I put grease in there for lubrication). Since the 4mm hole that was drilled did not go all the way through the hub, the plastic on the other side (back side) should cover the bearing completely and seal it from dirt as well. No problems there.

I agree with WibblyWobbly, you want the suspension to 'float' just as the suspension starts to work, this will keeps the wheels planted to the ground in rough terrain. Theoretically, if we assume that they designed the tank correctly out of the box, any addition weight added would require stiffer springs and vice versa.

3. nachtjager

I am sure there are a lot of very smart and talented people on the forum, that is why I joined this one. For you to make the assumption that my thread title inferred there were no talented people on this forum is crazy. I was trying to do the opposite and attract experts.


4. dgsselkirk

Suggestion noted. Thanks.
Last edited by CanadianBulldog22 on Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Saxondog
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by Saxondog »

Well said, Chris. :thumbup:
Bearings added to 1/6th scale Jagdpanther wheels to decrease friction and Rubber liners to increase track cohesion.
Bearings added to 1/6th scale Jagdpanther wheels to decrease friction and Rubber liners to increase track cohesion.
Urban dictionary-SAXONDOG-derogatory term for anglosaxon people
ALPHA
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by ALPHA »

Saxon... your tanks weigh over 200 lbs :haha: :haha: :haha: of course you need those bearings :haha: :haha:

ALPHA
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by ALPHA »

CanadianBulldog22 wrote:Hey guys,

I decided to continue with my thread. I want to address some of the comments that were left before I talk about the next topic.
:clap: :clap: :clap:
2. ALPHA & Wibblywoobly, RE: Topic #1

I like your thought process, I didn't even think about dirt in the tracks slowing it down. In my opinion I think the friction in the wheels is much more detrimental that one would expect. The coefficient of dynamic friction (friction constant while moving) of plastic on plastic is 0.20 in the best case. The coefficient of dynamic friction for a quality roller bearing is around 0.0018. That will create a frictional force over 100x larger without these very light bearings. It also helps smooth out the motion at slower speeds.

WibblyWobbly was concerned about mud getting into the bearings, if done correctly the bearing should be completely recessed into the plastic and you will be able to re-install the hub covers. This should keep anything from getting into the bearing from the front side (I put grease in there for lubrication). Since the 4mm hole that was drilled did not go all the way through the hub, the plastic on the other side (back side) should cover the bearing completely and seal it from dirt as well. No problems there.

I agree with WibblyWobbly, you want the suspension to 'float' just as the suspension starts to work, this will keeps the wheels planted to the ground in rough terrain. Theoretically, if we assume that they designed the tank correctly out of the box, any addition weight added would require stiffer springs and vice versa.
Yes the suspension really shouldn't be heavily compressed while the tank is at idle ... it should actually compress only under load.... or when activated by an obstacle...as the stock suspension should have been designed to handle the stock weight of the tank while static any changes to the suspension should only be done if you have increased the load that's put upon it...so anytime you exceed 12 lbs

What you say about the bearings is true...but at less that 8lbs...the drag coefficient though present ... has already been considered during the general design process from the factory....reason for the application of appropriate gear ratios... type of motors used ... and power supply ...bearings as you say do have a lower drag ratios...that's because of the bearing face...which is basically a micron of contact on the inner and outer race ..instead of the solid axle running within the wheel itself..
Pros and Cons to both I would say...bearing can rust...and can accumulate debris within the sealed mech...causing wear on all the contact faces....Wear does occur on the stock set up as well...but can be lessened by application of wax any kind of wax.... at anything below 12 lbs the wear would be limited...operation still smooth...as you add load....the added weight will increase face contact on both the axle and the inner bore of the wheel... adding in bearings would be the next step to improving the situation...So really... it isn't a necessary mod... it is once you exceed the designed tolerances set from the factory...I would say this is true with any mechanism ;)

ALPHA
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by tankman »

Canadianbulldog22 has a point, I have a Tamiya KT which runs much better after fitting bearings not just by removing rolling friction but by taking up the slack in manufacturing tolerances. This means the road wheels no longer flex so much when turning with the result I no longer get so much track binding during turns and therefore smoother operation and less stress on the gearbox and tracks.
I did however destroy both boxes by using 3 to1 gear downs to run metal tracks but thats another story lol
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by CanadianBulldog22 »

Tankman,

I never liked metal tracks, iv never broken the stock plastic ones. I only like doing metal upgrades if a stock parts breaks regularly. That's my opinion.

Chris
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Re: Heng Long Tanks - Advanced Modifications

Post by ALPHA »

CanadianBulldog22 wrote:Tankman,

I never liked metal tracks, iv never broken the stock plastic ones. I only like doing metal upgrades if a stock parts breaks regularly. That's my opinion.

Chris
I'm kind of with you on that Bulldog.... with the exception of not liking metal tracks :haha: ...to me it's one of the best things you can do if you want to improve the traction ...the upside is a lot of the added weight is still "unsprung" weight ...but the main reason for changing them out is because the pins don't come loose as much...especially on the thinner tracks ..like what's on the Panzer IIIs and IVs ;)

With that said ...I also tend to wait till parts show a lot of wear or break before doing anything about it ;)

ALPHA
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