big tank america scrap ah 250 Bxllxckx

[The Tank Man]

That is disgusting ! If they had packed it rite in the first place it would not have beam damage!!! There lack of packing protection is why it's ended up damaged!!! They should see this as a lesson leant and just send you a replacement! ASAP ! I've been seriously looking in to buying one of there tanks but if there not export packing there goods for overseas transportation I won't be takeing the risk of buy one off them. when items get sent anywhere you can expect it will have things placed on top of it and droped. Do you have to package the item up so it at least has some protection from this happening! They have to realise that people don't treat a parcel like it's got glass in it!! I hope they sort this out as at the moment they are looking very bad they must remember that there main buyers from all over the world read these forums and if it had been packed in the rite way this would not of happend.

[mcevoyi]

hi all

just like to say thank you for all the support i have been getting

hans of BTA .. seems to be doing something .. hes a bit stuck like me as it thanks giving over there in the usa ..so most retailers / suppilers are closed for the weekend now
so i dont expect to realy see any acrion till at least monday .... pants !!!

so here are some more pics of the damage ...

[caddyshack]

Hi Mcevoyi.

One quesstion did you pay for this by credit card. May be they can help you out , a little qicker than this so called Big Tanks. This is just not good business that he is now doing.. All he has to do is look at your pics, even if he wasn't the person who packed it. Word of mouth is a funny thing. This can soon get round quite a few forums. So He could well lose a lot of custum. Also getting a good name back is a lot harder than getting a bad one.
So Big tanks if you are reading this..post the guy a new model asap. That thing he recived is nothing more that scrap.

[mcevoyi]

hi there i paid with paypal ..

been ' chatting ' to Hans / BTA ... i must and we must not forget .. hes the retialer the man in the middle ...
and was suppied by Armour hobbies
i feel that after a few emails form hans .. that he will do the most he can to sort out this situation ...
lets have faith in him ..

[971wright]

Hi Iain ,Dont fall for any sob story ,You bought it from BTA,,they are responcible ,They should refund all your money and I would demand your import duty back as its for goods, not bits of scrap with no value.If Hans refuses to refund your money point out that you will post these photos on all Tank forums .That should get him to refund your money .

regards pete

[Saxondog]

I must agree with Iain Here, Give Hans a chance,to imply he has done anything wrong is not being fair at this point,he has had less than 12 hrs to react,it is a national Holiday here in the USA which makes it very difficult to contact anyone,in any business.

So please just give this person time,Iain is taking the right steps,and I'm sure Hans will do the right thing for Iain.

[Woz]

If you bought it with Paypal then apply for a refund through them.

They'll take the money from the retailers acc and it's up to the retailer to claim it back from the people he posted it with.

Having seen how it was packed I doubt they'll be able to claim for anything.

[Big Tanks of America]

Hi all,

I am in email contact with Iaian and will post our email conversation here soon for all to see what is really going on in this case.
We all know how easy and fun it is to be judgmental right away but missing the point sometimes.
In this case, it appears that it is MUCH MORE than just a damaged shipment.
More in the copies of my emails to Iaian.

[Big Tanks of America]

First email to me at about 4 am in the morning:



well the pile of scrap arrived here today

there was no proper packing what so ever ..as a result the 250 is total scrap
i am seriously dissapointed to say the least ...

the tracks are missing most of there pins
there are 23 links missing

the road wheels are damagaed and 2 missing

i would like to know what your going to do about it ??

pic enclosed and all over most of the 1/6 websites

seriously seriously
dissapointed
iain

2nd email about 5 minutes later...




hi all

the post man came this morning and deliver my much wanted armour hobbies
sdkfz 250

i opend the box ..and found a compelet pice of scrap broken knackered boday
and a pile of missing tracks and pins ..damaged road wheels

in a nut shell totaly fxxked

i am seriously serioulsy dissapointed

noe it up to hans ..what are thay going to do
there was no shipping packing to protect the parts as a result .. its 90% useless
Pictures were attached to both emails.

Today is my day off, it is THANKSGIVING HOLIDAY.

My reply sent 10.42 this morning !

Iaian,



I am sorry to see what happened, someone did send me a link to your post online and it looks horrible.

First thing for you to do is to claim damage with the postal service ! Do this right away ! This package was insured and to get insurance you need to claim "covered" damage. The damage was not plain to see when you received the box. So you have to claim it when you notice the damage. Maybe you also print out a picture or 2.

Once you have that done please email me the papers. I will also check with the post office tomorrow, its Thanksgiving Holiday today.



This claim is VERY important. Everybody who receives damaged goods is supposed to do so.



Here is what happened:

When we received the delivery we opened the first box that covered the inner box with the model. The inner box with the model was padded with big size bubble wrap. I do not recall opening the inner box with the model in it assuming the manufacturer will have it packed to standards. That was obviously wrong.



Please send me a list of parts broken and missing and email me the pictures rather than showing me a copy of your posting in a forum that doesnt not work in an email.

Since you want this vehicle rather than a refund we need to work together to get things straight here for you.

That includes the postal claim for insurance purposes and getting the replacement parts out to you in a safe way. I will pack them myself for this long journey to you.

Sorry for the delay, grieve and anger this has caused. I would have been upset like you opening this box with broken parts. Very disappointing. I will also contact the manufacturer to inform them about the inner packaging of their product which is sub-standard.
Please accept my apologies that we did not x-check this inner packaging to improve this. We should not have trusted in common sense here.
The one good thing that might come out of this story is that future customers will get this kit extra well padded, at least from us !
Now lets look forward to reverse this experience.



Thanks

Hans


2nd reply to 2nd email from him:

Iaian,



I received the pictures. No need to send more I think.



I will check with the post office tomorrow. Please do the same, it is very important.



Hans




His reply 11.32am
HANS
I have talked to royal mail

YOU HAVE TO CLAIM

i cannot claim as the the 250 has been insure
in the usa ... and the person who sent it has to claim

what i want to know is when will you solve this problem ..i need a time

as i am not going to wait weeks and weeks for the usps to do something about it
a poorly packed not checked scrap 250

iain


My reply 11.51 am on my day off and doing the laundry !

Iain,



thanks for the update. No, you do not need to wait for my claim. That will be independent from sending you replacement parts.

What I do not yet have from you is the list of parts broken/missing.

Once I have that I can take care of this and ship it out to you, well packed this time by myself.

I know you are upset but I do my best to get it worked out with you so you can start building the model.

This is the worst damage I have seen since I started my hobby-shop in 1999 ! I received from all over the world and shipped all over the world. It is followed by the polystone models made by dragon that no matter how well you packed them, they broke anyway like glass.



Now....that makes me think...

Our main business is plastic scale model kits made of polystyrene. This material is loosing its "softness" after years and simple tension can make it brake, built models in cabinets all of a sudden "throw" away their parts...material has some sort of "glass" effect to it.



What if this model was old stock where the softener in the plastic used dissolved over the years and it becomes as delicate as glass?

New stock would not have that problem. It is just a wild guess but since it is just a huge plastic scale model made of the same material like the small ones...

I can check that tomorrow earliest but that would explain the kind of cracks I see in the picture. Mind you, if you bought a new plastic scale model and you bend the e.g. sprue, it bends soft and does not break! An old sprue again could just break like glass...

The 250 is now at least about 5 years old and if old stock hits the market the material might be "tired" and "glassy".

Now I am very curious about finding that out, that would justify a recall of the whole batch that is recently offered by our wholesalers.



We are not just talking about not enough padding but also about "tired" material!



You can check this with one of the broken parts, if you bend a piece, is it flexible or does it break with a crack? It should not break with a crack !



Hans

His reply 12.04pm

HANS

i know its not realy your fault ..
and i would like to say sorry for you takeing the griff
from me ..
----
so money not that easy to come by ... i had to realy scimp and scrape the
cash together to but this .. so to say i was dissapointed
was realy an understatment
so sorry again hans

now list of parts

it big ......
lower hull
upper hull
two track drive sprockets ( teeth borken )
front suspension yoke .. and wheel turning brace bar that runns
between both front wheels
most of the metal pins that hold the tracks together missing
all the window visor leavers ..latches broken
front engine compartment doors hinges broken
rear door ..hinges broken ..
23 track links missing ...

as far as i can see that most of it ...

iain


His reply 12.06pm

hi hans

i would agree ...with that .. the parts may be
quite brittle ..as the who thing seems t have shattered like glass
that actualy a very good and accurate description form you

iain


My reply 12.30pm

Iaian,



with that it seems I have to send out a warning to the wholesalers tomorrow that are offering this kit to retailers like us!

There is no way to ship something so brittle safely, like polystone from Dragon.



Sorry to hear about your Afghanistan "experience" but the best parts are still ok! lol....



Now imagine, this kit is out now for about 5 years, all customers who did build one will have this problem sooner or later, it breaks for "no" reason, just the tension from gluing the parts together is enough to break the thing ! If it is OLD STOCK ! NEW PRODUCTION the softener in the plastic would not have dissolved yet and therefor would be flexible enough to absorb little rattling of the box. What I see in your pictures is NOT NORMAL !



Not talking of those that are converted into r/c....what a mess....



So this seems to be something bigger than just a damaged shipment.



I was reading your angry post about us and that we want to give you the run around and wait for insurance claim etc....

Please be fair to us and the public!

We never said that.

But there are certain procedures to minimize loss, one part is for you to check claim for damage.

Every country has different requests in a case like this.

And I never said you have to wait for our claim, the opposite is the case.



I need to know what parts are broken to check for replacement. That is important now for both of us.



The next questions is: If the other one I have in stock suffers from the same "glass" problem, you might not want this kit at all!

It will break while building OR anytime later in your shelves. AND no matter how well I will pack replacement, chances are these parts break, too!



I dont want to scare you here but I need you to think about this. So worst case scenario for you is money back, no problem! Or me shipping replacement parts that likely break, too if we have the "glass" problem here and it looks like we do.

That would give you more anger and would not solve the problem.

Mind you, if this material is tired...no matter where you would have bought one or would be buying from in the future, it is likely to get to you damaged !




His reply 12.48pm

ha ns

yes please post on all the site i have

i truly fully understand your the poor chap in the middle

i know you will resolve this problem as i have faith in you

it would be realy good to let evey one else see you doing more that you part

please post !

iain


That should do for all to judge by themselves.

I have to get dressed now for Thanksgiving dinner and will solve this problem with Iaian directly.
I think all options are talked about here.

I would have preferred Iain to not make this a public issue but now that it is done I think it was necessary to show the other side of the complaint...

Thanks
Hans

[mcevoyi]

thmm

thoughts any one ??