FYI..Taigen suspension Mod

[ALPHA]

Greetings Gentlemen... As some of you already know.. I am doing a re model of my Panzer IV
One of the upgrades is the road wheels... I feel I got a pretty good deal on all the components through EBAY....reason for the re model
I have already changed out the drive components... that will be detailed in the build
But this is what I found out about the Panzer IV suspension made by Taigen and what I did to resolve the bad design

This first photo shows three versions of the suspension... top ..the Taigen... below that the Heng Long... the one on the right.. the final mod... a combination of both...

There is so much wrong with the Taigen... I can see why dealers are trying to dump them are low prices... when installed...they offer no suspension at all.. pushing on the top of the hull gives no spring action...TERRIBLE... Though very pretty and well detailed..they are no better than "static" copies on regular models ...there is so much complexity to the design... but it simply does not work
There is an internal spring ...which is supposed to close the two arms... then the leaf spring with is supposed to be the ride suspension... it's too stiff...and does not allow the two arms to work individually
This is a photo of half of the suspension unit...the side with the leaf spring

It's actually very "good" looking... as it has a dual leaf below the molded imitation leaves... and is then shackled together with a nice metal band...I found looks aren't anything... as it doesn't function at all

By comparison..the Heng Long looks cheaper... and has a much simpler design...and is comprised of less parts...the big difference is... the Heng Long does work ...VERY WELL I might add ...you not only get the action of the arms...but the movement as a unit as it pivots on it's center point...
After a few hours of changing over one bank ... I realized how bad the Taigens were when I bounced the tank with my hand...I then also found I could not compress the Taigen suspension with my hands as an individual unit
Not wanting to waste the investment I had already made in the Taigen units...I broke both the Heng Long and Taigen down to their most simplest form... and analyzed the parts...first thing you will notice is the Taigen's Leaf... is longer... it does make a difference ...small ... but it does ...in a bad way

The Taigen has two individual leafs ... the Heng Long has one ...which actually is the reason it works better than the Taigen...The Heng Long leaf is "Spring" steel... the Taigen's are as well...but has lost it's spring due to what I think is a polishing process ...not hardening ...but softening the steel... causing it to loose any spring effect... the shorter one(the stiffener leaf) being the better of the two

So I take the long Spring steel leaf from the Heng Long... and combine it with the Shorter stiffener leaf of the Taigen and a few of the other components and make this

The combination is perfect IMO... you get the "bounce" and the "tilt"...but just a tad stiffer than the stock Heng Long ...The strength of Metal over plastic in this one weak area of the Heng Long Panzer IV...as the plastic tends to "tweak" sideways
The topping to it all is it's more adjustable as well.... I can easily make the suspension softer by removing the shackle that clamps the leaf ...allowing the Heng Long spring to take full arch...the stiffener spring then takes full function as well... as it reinforces the compression of the arms at mid point

The following picture are the parts that go into the scrap bin ..junk pile ...or garbage

the Heng Long casting is worth keeping ... the Taigen spring...


ALPHA

[ALPHA]

Now I know I might touch some sensitive tanking nerves with this post.... but for me ... I just have to let others know..

I am not dissing Taigen... I think they make an excellent Model... it just seems on this particular part...they really dropped the ball...

It also made me wonder... about all those who did purchase the Taigen Panzer IV..... what they thought of the suspension...because I couldn't find any information regarding complaints on it.... where they fooled by the pivoting on the center point ? I wouldn't know
What I do know now is... I would not recommend these as an upgrade unless you are doing a Heng Long...as you will have at hand the solution to a better unit

It is not an upgrade at all... but a downgrade in it's delivered form

Happy Tanking

ALPHA

[PainlessWolf]

Good Morning, Alpha,
This is exactly the kind of information that tankers on the Forum need to know. It's a great fix combining old HL tech with newer yet not so hot Taigen tech to produce what Taigen should have come out with in the first place. I have heard lots of stories about the metal suspensions losing the clips that hold them in place so this mod should fix that issue as well. Great job and illustration of the issue, Alpha.
regards,
Painless

[ALPHA]

Good Morning, Alpha,
This is exactly the kind of information that tankers on the Forum need to know. It's a great fix combining old HL tech with newer yet not so hot Taigen tech to produce what Taigen should have come out with in the first place. I have heard lots of stories about the metal suspensions losing the clips that hold them in place so this mod should fix that issue as well. Great job and illustration of the issue, Alpha.
regards,
Painless

It was frustrating to say the least... Just trying to help those who don't really realize how bad the Taigen suspension parts are...Imagine putting a couple of hours changing out the entire bank... smiling at first ..having a great time...then bouncing the tank...only to find the side you had just put time into...has to be re done again... not to mention modified
The lucky thing was they weren't too expensive... about 20 dollars for the entire set and yes... if the clip does come off now... the suspension only get's better

Have a good one Painless

ALPHA

[jarndice]

Privet Alfa, Nice and very helpful piece, I know when I was fitting my Heng Long suspension to my PZ4 that I had trouble with the clips slipping off until I applied a film of THREADLOCK to the clip, I have had no problems since, I recently saw that TAMIYA are advertising CARBON FIBRE replacement springs for the Panzer 4, I only got a glimpse of the article so I have no further detail but I figure steel has been doing the job since before the internal combustion engine so I would need to be persuaded that the newer alternate is better. Have a great week end old friend. shaun

[ALPHA]

Privet Alfa, Nice and very helpful piece, I know when I was fitting my Heng Long suspension to my PZ4 that I had trouble with the clips slipping off until I applied a film of THREADLOCK to the clip, I have had no problems since, I recently saw that TAMIYA are advertising CARBON FIBRE replacement springs for the Panzer 4, I only got a glimpse of the article so I have no further detail but I figure steel has been doing the job since before the internal combustion engine so I would need to be persuaded that the newer alternate is better. Have a great week end old friend. shaun

Pozdravleniya Shaun ...You tried putting the Heng Long suspension on your Panzer IV? What brand was that...I'm not familiar with the 1/16 Tamiya ...switching to carbon fiber would just raise the cost IMO ...I don't know though... but for sure I wouldn't want stiffer suspension
I have to admit... I never thought of using locktite ....I was going to put a drop of Shoe goo on the clip..but I like your idea better.... as I would be able to remove the clip should I want softer suspension

Spasibo Shaun

ALPHA

[Markocaster]

Interesting post Alpha, is it just the panzer suspension or are all Taigens like this?

[ALPHA]

Interesting post Alpha, is it just the panzer suspension or are all Taigens like this?

It's hard to say Mark.... If anything ... I think the problem would only be with the Taigen Panzer IV....as most of the rest of Taigen's line is torsion bars like the Tamiyas

With that said...it could be a generation thing.... It's my experience with Chinese and Taiwan products is a lot depends on generation...or time of release... these suspension parts could have come from an early batch of parts... sitting on the vendors shelf for years... When I bought it on ebay.. he did specify it was his last set..so for all I know ...He's expecting a new shipment of present day generation parts

If it isn't a generation thing.. I would definitely avoid purchasing the Taigen Panzer IV ...unless you are into going over every single screw on the tank

Thing to remember is all brands have glitches ...some minor ...some major... It's the nature of the beast... so just make sure whatever brand you do by... you have the time and patience to sort things out should they arise

HAPPY TANKING Mark

ALPHA

[strmnd54]

I have an Asiatam metal suspension that I bought a couple years ago for my old panzer IV.
When I decided last week to install it on my newer tank, I found out that not only it looks the same as the Taigen metal suspension; but it shares the same flaws...

So before I even knew about this thread, I proceeded to fix the suspension to my liking...

I took an approach different than yours...Here's some pictures with comments and a short video to show the difference before an after the mod....

http://youtu.be/ZIdrsxI1pO4?list=UUoWjH ... nVnrbH3GxQ

[ALPHA]

How well does yours compress...that's what I didn't like about the Taigens... they just didn't have any "spring" to them... they would just pivot on the hull support... so no "real" suspension per say

ALPHA