So today I bought this..

This section is for builds that are not strictly Tamiya or Heng Long. For instance, replacing the electronics from a WSN or Matorro, or even a scratch-build.

Postby Son of a gun-ner » Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:47 am

971wright wrote:Great bargain those gearboxes cost £20 then you have other parts which add up a good battery.plus the rest.


regards pete

Actually, those gearboxes look like the Taigen pro 4:1, although they are an earlier version than what's on offer now, possibly 35 quid at the time, over 40 now for a newer set.
So yeah, gearboxes alone, very much a bargain.

And yes, they look like they are Panther ones. Which should be ok in the jagd panther, although, for the jagd panther, they usually need a conversion like these ones.

Taigen 4:1 Pro Steel Gearbox Jagdpanther 380 Motors 18.000T + Conversion Kit
https://www.forgebeartanks.com/store/p5 ... __Kit.html
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Postby sinj » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:17 am

Son of a gun-ner wrote:
971wright wrote:Great bargain those gearboxes cost £20 then you have other parts which add up a good battery.plus the rest.


regards pete

Actually, those gearboxes look like the Taigen pro 4:1, although they are an earlier version than what's on offer now, possibly 35 quid at the time, over 40 now for a newer set.
So yeah, gearboxes alone, very much a bargain.

And yes, they look like they are Panther ones. Which should be ok in the jagd panther, although, for the jagd panther, they usually need a conversion like these ones.

Taigen 4:1 Pro Steel Gearbox Jagdpanther 380 Motors 18.000T + Conversion Kit
https://www.forgebeartanks.com/store/p5 ... __Kit.html


Oh brilliant, thanks for this info. I was going to shelve them and put original OEM gearboxes in. If they need a conversion that could possibly explain the bodge fitment/hacking of the hull.

John

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Postby sinj » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:22 am

Closer look at gearbox fitment.... or non fitment
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Postby sinj » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:31 am

Son of a gun-ner wrote:
971wright wrote:Great bargain those gearboxes cost £20 then you have other parts which add up a good battery.plus the rest.


regards pete

And yes, they look like they are Panther ones. Which should be ok in the jagd panther, although, for the jagd panther, they usually need a conversion like these ones.

Taigen 4:1 Pro Steel Gearbox Jagdpanther 380 Motors 18.000T + Conversion Kit
https://www.forgebeartanks.com/store/p5 ... __Kit.html


Looking at the link, Pete, these look the same as the ones I have in my Panther and the metal lower hull. Ill see what base they have or how they fit.
Am I to think the JP base is different then from standard Panther? I’ll be home later today so I’ll find out.

John

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Postby Son of a gun-ner » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:14 am

sinj wrote:Am I to think the JP base is different then from standard Panther? I’ll be home later today so I’ll find out.

John

John, if you look again in the link I gave you. Look at the second and third pictures, you will see a plate/bracket which is the conversion for the jagd panther. It's to hold and move the higher motor back and lower.
I'm not sure why it's needed, I'm guessing that the motor in the higher position may cause problems with the jagd Panthers upper hull fitting which doesn't apply to the standard panther. Could the higher motor get in the way of the gun innards (bb unit) when on high elevation?
Other than that extra motor bracket, these gear boxes should be the same as the ones for the Taigen panther with the lower hull metal base.

Mick.

Edit: I think Pete was more accurate with his gearbox valuation. The pro ones in the link have ball race bearings on all gear shafts. Although yours are the same boxes, they are the older version with bushes that the "pro" ones were produced to upgrade.
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Postby cashybai » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:19 am

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=26068

There's a link to a good reference book in there, also look for kajero jagdpanther and tank craft jp books, all a good read

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Postby sinj » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:15 am

cashybai wrote:https://www.rctankwarfare.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=26068

There's a link to a good reference book in there, also look for kajero jagdpanther and tank craft jp books, all a good read

Ooh nice thank you. I’ll look later. On shift now(although looking to make conversion bracket for motor/gearbox as it’s quiet ).
John

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Postby sinj » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:51 am

Son of a gun-ner wrote:
sinj wrote:Am I to think the JP base is different then from standard Panther? I’ll be home later today so I’ll find out.

John

John, if you look again in the link I gave you. Look at the second and third pictures, you will see a plate/bracket which is the conversion for the jagd panther. It's to hold and move the higher motor back and lower. .........
Mick.

Taking a closer look, I could see what you meant Mick. So I’ve made one( luckily a few quiet hours at work today), I’ll have to wait until I’m home at about 1900hrs to see if it fits.
Anyway here’s the process in pictures. Sorry for picture overload!
John
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Rough template for motor. Giving room for movement
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Trimmed excess for neatness and stop infringement of upper body
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Final fit making sure gears mesh nicely and not tightly.
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Postby sinj » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:10 pm

Only final placement will tell if I’ve made this correctly.
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Postby Son of a gun-ner » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:36 pm

:clap: :clap: bravo sir :thumbup:

Now make it in steel ;)

With close inspection of the pro box, it looks like the top of the motor is inline with the top of the two screws that hold the bracket to the gearbox.

Sorry, got to say, if you have this bracket as a test piece, I really would consider making the final bracket out of steel. Under load when you get this beast rolling, that aluminium plate is more likely to flex, and the brass motor pinion will only need to be out of mesh a little for it to get damaged and strip.
Also I noticed the plate/bracket is slightly spaced off the gearbox, it would be better if you could get them tighter together, would make it more stable, and align the pinion more with the first driven gear.
You may have to do a little indent where one of the gear shaft bushes goes. Also I would use a minimum of 2mm thick steel.
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Postby sinj » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:57 pm

Son of a gun-ner wrote::clap: :clap: bravo sir :thumbup:

Now make it in steel ;)

With close inspection of the pro box, it looks like the top of the motor is inline with the top of the two screws that hold the bracket to the gearbox.

Sorry, got to say, if you have this bracket as a test piece, I really would consider making the final bracket out of steel. Under load when you get this beast rolling, that aluminium plate is more likely to flex, and the brass motor pinion will only need to be out of mesh a little for it to get damaged and strip.
Also I noticed the plate/bracket is slightly spaced off the gearbox, it would be better if you could get them tighter together, would make it more stable, and align the pinion more with the first driven gear.
You may have to do a little indent where one of the gear shaft bushes goes. Also I would use a minimum of 2mm thick steel.


Good points. I was going to have this as a final piece but did wonder if alloy would flex, steel it is then. The spacer was to allow the head of the motor retaining screw. I can see what your saying from your observations so will act on them. We have no steel plate at work so will need to source some.
Thank you for your comment, phase two rectifying this mount will start soon
John

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Postby Son of a gun-ner » Fri Jul 12, 2019 1:06 pm

Cool. I wasn't trying to put your efforts down :thumbup:

Not sure if you are aware, but you can get cigarette rolling papers from a company called Rizla, they do different coloured packs, if you get the green pack, the papers are slightly thinner than the red/orange pack, about half a thousandth of an inch thinner. If I remember correctly, the red is three thou, and the greens are two and a half thou thick.
When setting up your gear mesh. Put a green paper in between the pinion and the driven gear to get a good mesh. You just turn the gears to remove the paper after all is tightened up.
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Postby sinj » Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:12 pm

Son of a gun-ner wrote:Cool. I wasn't trying to put your efforts down :thumbup:

Not sure if you are aware, but you can get cigarette rolling papers from a company called Rizla, they do different coloured packs, if you get the green pack, the papers are slightly thinner than the red/orange pack, about half a thousandth of an inch thinner. If I remember correctly, the red is three thou, and the greens are two and a half thou thick.
When setting up your gear mesh. Put a green paper in between the pinion and the driven gear to get a good mesh. You just turn the gears to remove the paper after all is tightened up.


I know of Rizla but not that papers are different thickness. Makes for cheap Plastigauge.
Great tip.
John

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Postby Son of a gun-ner » Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:23 pm

Yeah, they're quite handy. There is also blue ones, I think they are the thinnest. Been so long since I used them.
Thinking about it, the green ones may be the same thickness as the red ones. One of the colours all they did was remove two corners to make it easier to roll with a little rolling gadget.
I'll take a look later for some and report back lol.
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Postby mutt71 » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:08 am

43rdRecceReg wrote:The Panther looks fine, actually. Maybe a touch of muting of the colours on the wheels might do the trick. You'll find plenty of examples of other Panther camo schemes in the Forum archives, when you have the time, and one or two showing useful methods of 'ageing' the paintwork subtly. All your model needs is a slight bit of toning down (ageing). Otherwise, you have a nice model there. :thumbup:


For what it's worth, I totally agree! Remember that if you go lightly on the weathering, you can always add more to get the effect that you want. Trying to "undo" weathering, can be a little bit more work to undo. I found this out first hand when I went overboard when using pastel chalks to weather my Sherman.

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Postby sinj » Sat Jul 13, 2019 10:41 am

mutt71 wrote:
43rdRecceReg wrote:The Panther looks fine, actually. Maybe a touch of muting of the colours on the wheels might do the trick. You'll find plenty of examples of other Panther camo schemes in the Forum archives, when you have the time, and one or two showing useful methods of 'ageing' the paintwork subtly. All your model needs is a slight bit of toning down (ageing). Otherwise, you have a nice model there. :thumbup:


For what it's worth, I totally agree! Remember that if you go lightly on the weathering, you can always add more to get the effect that you want. Trying to "undo" weathering, can be a little bit more work to undo. I found this out first hand when I went overboard when using pastel chalks to weather my Sherman.


It’s the reason it’s not progressed. I’m scared to cock up the weathering! I’m going to read through this forum and I’ve been watching YouTube as well. The scratches etc I feel ok with but it’s tge overall dusting and splattering that I’m nervous of getting wrong. Stupid I know.

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Postby HERMAN BIX » Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:36 pm

With weathering, its not how you start, but how you finish that gives you the end result.
But you need to start somewhere.
Remember, a tank in combat has multiple aspects of weather effects playing upon it.
Is it in a very wet theatre of operations ?
Is it in a very dry/dusty T.O.O. ?
Does it rain much ?
Does that rain wash dust off?
Does the rain wash the dust off and then turn the dry earth to mud ?
Does the mud get thrown up ?
European soil is generally quite dark, and sticky.............when it dries, its going to be clumpy and pronounced.
German tanks had little time to recover and refit/repair as they were always on the defensive by the time Jagdpanthers were on the scene, so any that were operational would not have time to waste cleaning or otherwise mucking around dodging the masses of enemy ground forces, plus the relentless threat of air attack.

So.........how much is too much ?
The day, the place, the circumstances, the crew, the environment, ...............your tank-your way.
As is the almost immortal statement from an outfit that makes shoes "just do it"
And our equally important mantra "just show us"............pictures please. ;)
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Postby sinj » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:36 pm

HERMAN BIX wrote:......
So.........how much is too much ?
The day, the place, the circumstances, the crew, the environment, ...............your tank-your way.
As is the almost immortal statement from an outfit that makes shoes "just do it"
And our equally important mantra "just show us"............pictures please. ;)


Thank you for this reply. Very inspiring. You’re right of course, I’ve got to jump in and get involved.
I’ll think about TOO and unit involved and also who manufactured too, MIAG had certain idiosyncratic placements etc. Above all I’m gonna enjoy this and definitely I’ll be documenting as I go. Info passed to me so far has been amazing so thanks to everyone.

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Postby mutt71 » Sat Jul 13, 2019 8:04 pm

The intimidation factor is huge, at least it has been for me. Trying something new can be tough.
I just weathered my HL Sherman 105MM with paint, like I always have in the past. I then tried weathering with European pastel chalk. I watched the You tube videos several times, took some notes for reference and started in on it. I did not like how it came out at all. I ended up washing it of and starting over again. If I can do it,I encourage you to do as you want to and ow you want it to look. I am going to try to get some photos up of the Sherman, so you can see what I ended up with.

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Postby sinj » Sat Jul 13, 2019 8:12 pm

I get you. I think with reference to Panther, the camo was stenciled and masked. But I’m being a silly. I think I’ll bring the JP up to a level then weather. Got some scratch building to do too. I did a few things on Panther that I’ll do again to JP.
Look forward to seeing the Sherman too

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