To Smoke, Or Not To Smoke, That Is The Question

Smoke creating devices!

Postby Burger_Patrol1 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:26 am

I am working on a slow Tamiya Build and am on the fence about trying to convert it to be a smoker. I wanted to find out what tankers think about smoke units in general? I don't know much about them and electronics is my weak area, so I'm not sure if this would be worth the trouble. What do you think? :think:
Pros?
Cons?

Thanks,
Dano
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Postby Max-U52 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:17 pm

it's really all a matter of preference. Most tanks, especially the German tanks, didn't really produce smoke. We add the effect to get the wow factor, but it's not truly accurate. Now the Russian tanks, most of them being diesels, were a different animal and I've seen some videos of T34s that smoked like chimneys.

What kind of tank are you building? Smokers aren't that complicated and there are threads here for building more compact units, something you may need in a tammy tank.
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Postby HERMAN BIX » Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:20 pm

Ive found that smokers are a novel feature of a tank, depending on its context.
At a show or hobby expo, smokers are great, but for those that know the tank they are running, smokers are not so important for the exact reasons you mentioned.

Tell ya what

Put one in and make it work.
Then its up to you if or when you use it.
What else would you do with the space eh !!
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Postby Burger_Patrol1 » Wed Feb 14, 2018 4:30 am

Max-U52 wrote:it's really all a matter of preference. Most tanks, especially the German tanks, didn't really produce smoke. We add the effect to get the wow factor, but it's not truly accurate. Now the Russian tanks, most of them being diesels, were a different animal and I've seen some videos of T34s that smoked like chimneys.

What kind of tank are you building? Smokers aren't that complicated and there are threads here for building more compact units, something you may need in a tammy tank.


Hi Max-U52,
Thanks for your input...I am giving my old Tamiya Tiger 1 a face lift. I will look on some threads to see if anything jumps out at me. Thanks again, have a good one. :wave:
Regards,
Dano
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Postby Burger_Patrol1 » Wed Feb 14, 2018 4:35 am

HERMAN BIX wrote:Ive found that smokers are a novel feature of a tank, depending on its context.
At a show or hobby expo, smokers are great, but for those that know the tank they are running, smokers are not so important for the exact reasons you mentioned.

Tell ya what

Put one in and make it work.
Then its up to you if or when you use it.
What else would you do with the space eh !!


Thanks Mr. Bix....that sounds like real good advice!! At least I will be able to say I put a smoke unit in, even if I decide not to use it that much. I can run the smoke when my Nephews come to visit :D
Regards,
Dano
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Postby RenoirLV » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:25 am

I like smokers. Only the use is rather limited. I always switch it on when doing outdoor driving. I like that little smoke it produces.
But never indoors because of the smell.
I think this area is a bit problematic because a realistic effect is achieved by default pump action smokers that are cheap and ok but make a terrible noise.
And those that are silent do not really make the smoke effect realistic. As they are driven by a computer fan and do not make puffs.
I currently have one of the latter which is proportional and all that stuff but Im not entirely happy with it.
These fan units are small and efficient, but they do not produce much smoke and it comes out in a stream, which is not good.
Then there are some hard core units like Benedini that take up so much space that not all people can afford them. But they will give extreme smoke. Perhaps even too much for a Tiger tank.
My ideal solution would be to make the pump-action smoker less noisy (if possible at all) and make it proportional. I've been toying with this idea for a while.

As far as I know Tamiya has a huge speaker box at the end of the lower hull. It is just in the way for any smoker unit.
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Postby RobW » Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:28 pm

I don't use them, simply because the idea of a heat source & flammable liquid in an expensive plastic container (the tank) really doesn't appeal!

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Postby RenoirLV » Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:28 pm

Are there actually any reports of fire?
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Postby Tiggr » Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:08 pm

Smoke for me....

Would be better if the smoke kicked in on ignition, but hey ho, makes me smile. :thumbup:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pb5GojDFqu4



Same tank with Beier sound card added:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT7ZmjDejSQ&t=89s
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Postby Rad_Schuhart » Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:38 pm

RobW wrote:I don't use them, simply because the idea of a heat source & flammable liquid in an expensive plastic container (the tank) really doesn't appeal!


The heat is not very heat and it wont melt any plastic... And also I had never ever a problem of igniting the heng long parafin or baby oil. It does not burn not even if you try to do it on purpose...

So yeah, plenty of smoke for me.
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Postby dgsselkirk » Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:58 pm

RenoirLV wrote:Are there actually any reports of fire?



none I have ever seen or heard of....

I use and sell TARR smokers. (Have 8 tanks with them and have had them in probably 10 others) You can get proportional ones and when you use them with megasteam look and run great. You have your choice plastic or thick aluminum box which is what I use. they get warm but you can still hold them in your hand no problem. The resistor would never get hot enough for open flame, only pumping 5V and low amps through it...
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Postby Burger_Patrol1 » Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:24 am

Thanks all for the great Information on the smokers. Good discussion and points well taken. :thumbup:
Regards,
Dano
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Postby gp100 » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:56 pm

Max-U52 wrote:it's really all a matter of preference. Most tanks, especially the German tanks, didn't really produce smoke. We add the effect to get the wow factor, but it's not truly accurate. Now the Russian tanks, most of them being diesels, were a different animal and I've seen some videos of T34s that smoked like chimneys.



I agree,

Tanks that produced a lot of smoke while in hiding would be giving away their position to easily to the enemy.. Might as well set off a flair and say "shoot here."

We do it because it looks cool and the wow factor as Max said.. But the reality is, real tanks very rarely produced any real smoke unless they were in serious need of maintenance, or had a bad tune job done on the motor..

As to the T34, well, it was Russian made.. What do you expect? :P
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Postby Dr Phibes » Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:20 pm

I like smokers in my tanks as they bring them to life - especially the plume when I start mt KT with a Tarr smoker and MegaSteam oil. I also boost the voltage a little on this but it's not really needed the regulator works mostly to maintain voltage as the battery dips with use and less smaoke would otherwise result. The main problem with Tarr smokers is that they produce a steady stream of smoke rather than pulsing it. One option is conversion to an acoustic smoker but this can get a little tricky too.
In truth I typically turn the smoker off if I'm running my tank for any length of time, it is mainly a show thing and, as already said, a matter of personal choice.
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Postby HERMAN BIX » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:42 pm

Diesel sooting is different than petrol smoke.
Diesels back then would have been real sooty..................petrols really shouldnt 'smoke' as such unless they were in bad need of valve guides or rings etc, but the rate of destruction would have meant that most would have been fairly early in their wear lives.
I assume Soviet Diesels would have been also newish in service life, but prone to heavy soot and poor injection ratio due to manufacturing inconsistency and filter restrictions.
Assumption, but looking at period film, the only explanation I can think of.
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Postby 43rdRecceReg » Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:37 pm

Well, cop a peek at this Sherman,then...
phpBB [video]

and then this Rolls-Royce powered Cromwell:
phpBB [video]

Yeah, granted they're now pensioners, but presumably the piston rings,valves and valve stem oil seals, have been replaced since the War :| ;)
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