Elmod - What motors do you run?

[wibblywobbly]

I am keen to find out who has the latest Thinktank board with the plug in Soundblaster, not the early seperate card set-up.

If you have the latest setup, what motors do you run? Elmod say that the Jamara Pro 480, and the Standard HL's are the only recommended fitment, but have you tried others without causing problems?

It would be nice to know if there are any other tried and tested options out there.

Rob G

[swathdiver]

Why can't you conform and go along with the instructions? 

[wibblywobbly]

I am just curious.

Permax 480's were used by a member on the old boards ok. See pic.

I have tried the Jamara 480 HS BB's, as another forum member used them on the old boards without problems,

Previous post...
"hi guys, i'm using jamara 480 hs bb motors http://alshobbies.com/shop/lookupstock. ... 5916&Desc= you can get then here, i got to say since ive been using them(18monthes)they are the dogs danglies, they got a shed load of torque and are a good quality motor, i got mine from nigel my mate. i am using elmod along side them, but they seem to work ok with HL boards as long as youre tank aint to heavy, its worth saying that using 3.1 boxes with these motors is just the right thing to do, the motors spin to about 17.500rpm so the reduction gear slows them down abit, but gives them more torque than you really need in a tank!"

.. but these melted the new style board that I had. I then tried Protech Zoom 400's (which are actually 380's) that will run under any conditions on an RX14 board in the same tank..and they melted a new Elmod board too??

It's a 13lb tank and I am simply keen to establish who has used different motors, what they were, and what the performance was. Thomas and I have come to an agreement that they will repair both my new boards again, and I will try standard HL and Jamara 480 Pro's. If they melt again then they will refund my hard earned cash.

It's a long (very long) story,

18/10/2008
Me : "1. Can I fit 2x 480 5 amp motors with the ThinkTank Booster and Afterburner?"
Thomas "yes, you can."

21/03/09
Thomas: "I'm not sure which motor type you use, so just to be sure: do not use Jamara/Li-Power 480 HS BB! For some reason they don't work with our ESCs."

I am keen to find out if anyone else has successfully used different motors with the new style boards, not trying to avoid using motors that Elmod now recommend. Elmod didn't know that the HS BB's could blow the new boards until I told them so (and still don't know why), and there may be others. The easiest way to find out is to ask? 

Rob G

[Aus_Tank]

This is very strange. I don't wish to hijack the thread but why hasn't Thomas (elmod) carried out some in depth tests?? Aren't the Esc's the same as what was installed on the previous boards. Maybe PCB layout and/or other components are causing the failures?

I have the older gear (Big Booster, TLS and Blaster II) in my HL Tiger running standard Black Cap motors through after market steel gearboxes. I have been extremely impressed with it so far.......not going to change out the motors tho! 


Phill

[wibblywobbly]

They used the same esc's in the new board as they did in the old ones. They have a melting point of 300 degrees? Strange thing is that even with a friend here, using a digital thermo detector, and running the board outside of the tank, with the tank raised off the ground (so no load), they still started smoking with no detectable increase in temperature. That board was sent back to Thomas for testing even though it was still running the motors. He said there was nothing wrong with it and sent it back. It melted the esc's as soon as the tank hit a shallow gradient, even with the Protech motors in there. It has always been the same esc's, not all of them, and I would love to know what volts/amps etc the boards are designed to cope with as that should determine the choice of motors. Without that info it's hit and miss?

I did conduct some pretty exhaustive tests to nail down the problem, and to prove to myself that something wasn't right. These were all documented and I gave Thomas a copy. He doesn't know why the esc's malfunction, but I would have thought that they would simply buy a selection of motors/tanks/weights and try them, and then provide advice on what is best.

When I get my boards back I will run the same tests and video them, if anything amiss happens then there will be no disputing it. The problem with using less powerful motors is a decrease in power in a heavy tank. If I could get hold of a set of the original boards I would.

I should have them back next week. I actually want this to work as the sound system on the Elmod is quite extraordinary.

Rob G

[The Blitz]

Hey Wibbly wobby,, I am starting some testing as well! I have one more dumb question for you.. Did you have the correct capaitors on the motors you installed?

And a second thought I know that EL MOD has conceeded some motors are a problem,, what about running them throuht the after burner?? That is what Swathdiver is doing to run 480 off of an older EL MOD Heng long boards setup! No I agree we should not have to do this but,, it is just a thought until EL MOD can address this?

The Blitz

[swathdiver]

I set up Tiger 211 to run with El Mod, Afterburner through Heng Long TK-RX13 for radio control.  Paired up the Jamara 480 HS PRO motors with Asiatam 3-1 gearbox.

During tests I ran the motors directly off the El Mod Booster with no ill effects, slight warming of the heatsink.  Off the Afterburner the heatsink has never gotten warm.  The tank has so much power that when encountering resistance in sugar sand it would boost power to the affected track and nearly always throw that or both tracks even when equipped with Asiatam idlers.  It's incredibly powerful.

The tank is the fastest in my stable as well.  While the Walker BullDog with Speed400s and stock gears was quicker off the line, Tiger 211 quickly catches up and runs away from it.  Using my calculator, El Mod had the motors turning nearly 30,000rpms to deliver that kind of speed over a measured distance.  I lost the data on an excel file but I may have posted it on RCU, have to look.

The tank is hard to control and keep in a straight line because of the booster coupled with the powerful motors.  The next time I get to open it up I plan to remove the 480s and 3-1s and use what they told me to do in the beginning, stock boxes with black capped motors! 

I'll probably pull El Mod and install it in one of my M4A1(76)Ws, they should be hitting the shelves soon.

[wibblywobbly]

@The Blitz - According to Thomas the afterburner is not required with the latest Thinktank board, I asked him about installing meatier heatsinks but he says that these are not necessary either. Due to the design of the new board there doesn't appear to be any way of installing the afterburner, so I can't upgrade the board that way. The capacitor issue is one I have been following. As far as I can tell the Jamara 480 HS BB's have them inside the casing, the Protech Zoom 400's definately have them on the outside.

@Swathdiver - I don't doubt what you are saying for a single second, for some inexplicable reason the old system with an afterburner appears to be capable of handling virtually any motor. I have never heard of one failing. All I can do is await the return of my two Thinktank boards (both are the new design) and try HL motors initially, and then the Jamara 480 Pro's. Thomas says that these will work, so I have to give them a try. I amazed at the performance that you were getting from your set-up, my Tiger never accelerated beyond what you can see in my videos, and would not climb the shallowest of gradients, or climb over slight bumps. Climbing over my foot was simply impossible. It simply stalled and refused to move.

The Protechs and an RX14 board maked the tank zip around and climb anything, so the only problem can be the Thinktank board. Nothing else was changed?

I will post an update when I get the boards back.

Rob G

[swathdiver]

If the electronics are running right you won't need the big motors, they're too powerful IMO.  I don't know if I was using aftermarket ESCs with a different radio would have made a difference in controlability.  The software limits voltage to the motors at 5.5V so that when the tank encounters resistance it can boost voltage to one or both tracks.  I posted a video of it running in place on youtube with the WattsUp Meter attached.

[wibblywobbly]

I know! Your video was one of those that influenced my decision to get the Elmod boards, along with all those others on You Tube. I spent a full year debating the issue with my wallet and then took the plunge. Interestingly, when the tank hits resistance the sound changes to indicate an increase in power when I push the stick forward, but nothing happens with the motors, they simply stall and put strain on the esc's. It takes about 1 second to kill them.

On the test bench we had a digital thermo tool, and a clamp meter. There was nothing being pulled by the motors that should have caused any problems.

We even attached a motor directly to the battery, and tested the amps etc. Even trying to lock the gearbox shaft didn't pull more than 10 amps. Most of the time it was 3amps which is well within operating tolerances. Those HS BB's are incredibly powerful, but they have now been sold!

Ho hum.